Author: sajolida Date: To: The Tails public development discussion list, zlatan Subject: Re: [Tails-dev] interesting free tablet
intrigeri: > sajolida wrote (23 May 2016 16:27:04 GMT) :
>> intrigeri:
>>> Now, we do have certain reservations regarding shipping preinstalled
>>> Tails (https://tails.boum.org/support/faq/#preinstalled), so we would
>>> need to find a way to communicate clearly to the users 1. who they are
>>> trusting (or not) when they use the Tails that comes installed on the
>>> aforementioned microSD card; 2. how to re-install Tails on that
>>> microSD card, in a way that avoids any such trust issues (we have
>>> pretty good doc for that). The way I see it, it's a mere matter of
>>> communication, but other project members might feel differently.
>
>> Definitely, this would require a very long collective discussion before
>> we can consider be happy with having companies shipping preinstalled
>> Tails in a commercial product.
>
> Sure, collectively defining what would make us, as a project, happy,
> would be a very long process. I have little interest in going through
> that personally about this specific topic. There are plenty of other
> sides to collective happiness that matter more to me, and on this one
> I see little room for strong consensus, so I bet that whatever happens
> (or is prevented from happening) won't make everyone happy.
>
> Now, technically anyone can ship Tails inside a product, regardless of
> whether it would make us happy, since Tails is free software; they
> might even manage to do it right, if they're up to addressing the
> specific concerns we have documented.
>
> OTOH, we can discourage them pretty easily, it's super cheap and it
> requires no painfully long collective discussion about what "doing it
> right" could possibly mean.
>
> I'm not 100% certain myself of what exactly I would be happy with.
> But I really don't want to assume, as a starting point, that nobody is
> able to do "it" in a way I would find satisfactory, so I intend to
> keep explaining what our specific concerns with pre-installed Tails
> are, and how they could possibly be addressed.
>
>> I personally would rather spend that time
>> discussing how to make installing Tails easier and more secure for
>> everybody.
>
> Yes, let's please keep up the good work in this area :)
>
>>> Still, there's the freshness problem given we release every six weeks,
>>> and I doubt that your supply chain can guarantee that only up-to-date
>>> Tails are shipped to the user (and even if that was possible, the
>>> shipping delay can be enough to make it untrue again). Thankfully we
>>> have quite user-friendly automatic updates, so this problem isn't as
>>> bad for microSD as it would be for preinstalled DVDs.
>
>> Until we have #7499 [1] ("full-self upgrade"), receiving an SD card that
>> has been flashed 6 months ago means today, upgrading 9 times in a row,
>> restarting and reconnecting to Tor each time, which probably takes more
>> time and definitely generates more frustration than downloading a fresh
>> ISO and burning a DVD.
>
> Absolutely. JFTR, I didn't mean to imply that shipping 6 months old
> Tails was an OK delay: IMO it would be way too long.
