(resending with the proper email account, and changed initial textt for
topic 2)
sorry, I don't have too much time to write, and topic is serious, the
idea could be confusing, but just get the idea, if it makes sense to
work on that, and not as a formal proposal
## Response to topic one (meeting minutes markdown)
You could use this link:
https://pad.cas.cat/LibreMesh_meetup_2024 and
if you run into any problem, you would contact me directly
I don't remove any pad, but it is good practice to have a backup
anywhere, in fact, due to the markdown nature, pulling it from a git
forge thing, will make it a nice render and so on
## Response to topic two (pay libremesh developers to attend meetings)
To avoid confusion: I am not talking that ALL libremesh developers
should get paid or attending libremesh meetings, but ALL libremesh
developers that are currently being contracted by altermundi, which
holds the trademark and the origin of the product
Developers could be volunteer or professional. Developers SHOULD
compensate professionaly (if is their role) the hours dedicated in the
libremesh developer meeting with their contractor/accountability/accounting
I also see it is weird to use donations for paying the already
contracted libremesh developers to attend. I would ask for part of the
current budget they have, to spend on the community part, because I feel
so natural that way. We are talking about open source projects and
communities, and they should account time to spend with the community.
If they cannot pay developer hours for the meeting (1h/month), come on!
And there are two ways, the project manager acknowledge that, or we ask
the developers to justify an hour in their timesheets or whatever they
account on work, that they spend time in the community meeting; and I
suppose that should not be a problem
In guifi we have a lot of experience managing volunteer and professional
work, is simple:
1. volunteers put their best effort on the subject, in terms of service,
no SLA
2. professionals commit for their work (that's why they get paid), in
terms of service, certain SLA and responsability on their actions
That means that libremesh community meetings, should be different roles
for different people; ones representing interests on existing community
networks in international scope, others representing interests on
certain (funded?) projects, others working on that
I have another example, which would be pretty common, natural, and in
fact, traditional or old way of managing stuff, I am part of the
governing council of a non profit cooperative (somconnexio.coop ; same
would apply for somenergia.coop ), this is not a paid position, but the
cooperative, in their statutes, said that the governing is from the
governing council (and that their positions are unpayed), the positions
come from votes from all people that conform the cooperative. Inside the
cooperative, there are also workers that get paid for their job; but
others receive services from the cooperative. That is "putting
everything in one organization", but the more common way of doing this
internationally is through a foundation (or a non profit association),
and different providers and stakeholders
On 10/9/23 14:37, Ilario via LibreMesh wrote:
> On 10/9/23 13:55, Pedro via LibreMesh wrote:
>> - Proposal on using markdown in meeting notes: I think it might be
>> better to use a tool that writes markdown and renders anything, which
>> is becoming pretty common these days. I know two services that does
>> it using opensource software: hedgedoc.org and cryptpad.fr ; both are
>> nice, is just finding an instance that works fine and complies with
>> ethical values. Hedgedoc demo says is not good for production; and I
>> have my own hedgedoc instance that you could use. I am not aware of
>> any problems with cryptpad, I think they are friendly
>> - here is an example
>> https://cryptpad.fr/code/#/2/code/edit/KEEwOW5MnHu2lLJg9S6XU9Rx/
>> - and with this link you instance a new pad https://cryptpad.fr/code/
>> - cryptpad makes it in a way that the file is encrypted with the
>> password in the URL which is not logged in the server; they
>> officially suggest that if you want a well-known URL you should use a
>> URL shortener
>
> Thanks Pedro!
> We were planning to use EtherPad on Disroot as they have a plugin for
> the table of content (but it does not show automatically, you have to
> activate it each time you open the pad, so it is not very user friendly).
>
> So, using Hedgedoc on your server sounds like a very good idea :)
>
> Link?
>
> Cryptpad also would work, but we don't need all the crypto-features
> for public meetings.
>
> On a parallel topic:
> the main Jitsi Meet server started asking for authentication of at
> least one participant in the meeting. This would be more than ok, if
> it wasn't that they only accept authentication via Google, Facebook or
> Github.
>
> So maybe, additionally to the usual server in Argentina, we can start
> using meet.guifi.net as fallback server?
>
>> - Bringing attention to libremesh devs: I contacted konejo, and I
>> thought (and that is a discussion, not a fact): libremesh developers
>> should get paid for attending the community meeting; that's a way to
>> ensure they appear there, that is also a way attract the interest of
>> the project manager (or the person who manages their work) and then,
>> a discussion could follow of matching altermundi's own needs with
>> international community needs.
>
> Technically is possible, we have donations money, we can use them for
> paying people to attend meetings.
>
> It sounds weird to me, but can be done. Rather, I would see logical
> that Altermundi (I suppose that is Altermundi the association managing
> the grants used for funding the developers) pays them for attending
> the project meetings, participate in the Matrix/Element chat and
> mailing list.
>
> Does anyone have experience in other open source projects which had to
> deal with a mix of waged and volunteer work? How is that managed?
>
>> That also enters a discussion on the date for the meeting. I think it
>> is bad practice to be on weekend. Because weekends are in general,
>> nice moments to make hikings, attend festivals, meet
>> familiars/family/friends (and that matters specially if you reached
>> 30 year old), and/or do a small disconnect from our busy week. So
>> instead of discussing about weekend or not weekend timing (which
>> exceptionally, few days a year, could be good idea for very-busy
>> volunteers during the week), I would prefer to discuss on office vs
>> no office hours during the week (definition: office = usually working
>> hours in human labor), and what are the proper days for that
>
> Sure, I can also join meetings at dinner time in Europe during
> weekdays (e.g. from 20:30 to 21:30-22:00 European time), which in the
> Americas would be late afternoon. For people in Asia it would be
> difficult to attend, but additional meetings can be organized at
> different times.
>
> We did a Framadate survey in October-November 2022, and Saturdays at
> 13UTC were the winning option, but I cannot recall whether we included
> European after-dinner time between the options. So we can run another
> of such surveys.
> Pedro, are you up for running a new survey with some alternatives out
> of the weekend?
>
> Ciao!
> Ilario
>
