On Fri, Dec 26, 2008 at 05:41:48PM +0100, Raistlin wrote:
> Sve Null wrote:
> > Why not just ASK THEM before jumping to conclusions?
>
> Eh, gia' :)
io cosi' ho fatto.
la risposta e' che la deadline e' oggi dopodiche' il libro e' chiuso.
ma nella loro risposta x mail non tengono assolutamente in conto le
mie argomentazioni ne' la possibilita' che il libro resti aperto.
come network dyne/freaknet alla fine stiamo seguendo il parere di Alpt
e lasciando perdere alla fine, loro fanno le "cose loro" e noi
"facciamo le nostre" - ma intanto un ultimo tentativo per tenere tutto
insieme qualcuno a Berlino lo sta facendo.
una cosa e' certa: che non ci mettiamo dentro Weaver Birds (che al
contrario uscira' in un prossimo libro con la SHAKE) e che se non
danno spazio anche a tutti gli altri che siamo in italia e spagna noi
ci cancelliamo da hackerspaces.net ed invitiamo gli altri a farlo.
spero da tutto questo possa nascere l'iniziativa per un VERO libro che
sia piu' che una storicizzazione un HOW TO di come fare a mettere su
un hacker space (che noi di solito chiamiamo hacklab). credo che con
tutti i fantocci che stanno prendendo il sopravvento nella nostra
scena sia pure un'iniziativa MOLTO IMPORTANTE, per esempio questi
FINTI POSERS tipo Mayhem, Raistlin etc. non sono MAI stati coinvolti
in nulla di VERO come un hacklab e stabilire chi fa cosa e' un ottimo
modo di mettere i puntini sulle i
una discussione a riguardo gli hacker spaces, buon punto di partenza
per il lavoro editoriale, la facemmo con indonesiani e l'ho riportata
qui:
http://jaromil.dyne.org/journal/jakarta_hackermeeting.html linka
anche ad un documento del CCC
di sotto la mia proposta di prolungamento call ai nordatlantici:
- From jaromil@???
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 22:55:59 +0100
Subject: Re: "thanks" for excluding us
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hi Astera and others,
On Thu, Dec 25, 2008 at 10:31:57PM +0100, astera wrote:
> Hey again,
>>
>> i just hope more people will make it in time.
>
> We are featuring 30 hackerspaces from all over the world in this
> issue,
my criticism is all about this: what is your perception of "all over
the world"? there is a widespread movement developing hacker spaces
all over the world, including places from the *south* which aren't
present at all in the book right now. this argument alone should be
enough to delay the deadline and let the call propagate further, you
are all aware of the rush we are applying on this (even in the call
itself) and i'm urging you to re-think that.
also we need to know the *reason* why you are rushing this delicate
process, since people is really asking it.
still in case you intend to publish the hackerspace book with such a
rush anyway, it would be necessary to mention about more places that
are excluded and defining the pattern of inclusion you applied.
i'm talking of several places active since about 10 years in the south
of Europe, in Brasil, in Indonesia and other places. these places are
really inspiring and should be included to complete the picture.
why a complete picture? well as hackers we are at large and
intentioned to criticise boundaries, while present exclusion mostly
marks them.
this document, which i understand is not realistic to apply for, talks
about all this:
>> http://dyne.org/weaver_birds.pdf
>> http://dyne.org/weaver_birds-it.pdf
you might or might not agree with the Weaver Birds contents, still
this is all produced after an 8 year work of confrontation of
different views and grouping of contributions - and it took 8 years!
well ok, it took long because this document is mostly theoretical,
while the hackerspace book is mostly practical, i understand.
furthermore it would be nice to modularise the editorial group and
open it up to the production of more than one book at different times,
i and more people can volunteer for the editorial work on such a
documentation from the places i'm claiming that are excluded.
why all this? because "historicisation" and "mapping" are very
delicate operations and should never be done without a peer review and
proper space for different situations, i am sure you agree on this.
> I thank you for your submission papers; however, we had quite a
> 'ruleset' on all contributions. Since I'm unsure if, as for now,
> you've gotten the initial letter Bre sent out on Dec. 15th at all,
> I'll forward it to you within the next minutes.
no letter was received. we are a large network and i'm not really
able to dedicate time to read medialab@??? these days - it's
an old emailbox and for external communication we mostly use webforms
and captchas, i guess you get the reasons.
> I'm afraid I can't expect any other texts than we were asking for
this is totally reasonable. regarding our specific hacker spaces for
dyne/freaknet i asked for help to other hackers today (lazy xmas). if
i'm not alone on this, as i believe, you'll have the contributions
properly formatted for monday as you ask.
still i feel like lots are excluded and i wish you will get something
from hacker spaces from spain, italy and brasil at least, where some
important experiences are evolving.
> At least I'm trying to do my best in any situation. ^^
thanks!
ciao
- - --
jaromil, dyne.org developer,
http://jaromil.dyne.org
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